Date is 2015-06-26, times are UTC+10.

--- Log opened Fri Jun 26 06:49:31 2015
07:03 < whot> rightyo, matt is still offline but let's get started anyway
07:04 < whot> agenda is small, we have expo, spi and a gsoc update
07:04 < whot> agd5f: want to start with gsoc?
07:04 < agd5f> whot, nothing to report at this point
07:05 < whot> ok, that was quick then :)
07:05 < whot> robclark: expo migration?
07:06 < robclark> so..  short version.. we have members site up and running on openshift, and seems to be working..
07:06 < robclark> whot managed to replicate the setup based on my backup..
07:06 < mupuf2> we should send the url of every srudent's blog. need to check if they really wrote their blog article
07:06 < robclark> haven't done the wiki yet.. but what was done so far was fairly straightforward
07:06 < robclark> (mupuf, good idea)
07:07 < robclark> so there is one caveat w/ openshift stuff..
07:07 < robclark> we do need members web site to be able to send emails..
07:07 < robclark> like password changes, etc..
07:07 < robclark> so I think we'll end up having to setup some sort of mail proxy type thing at least for that..
07:07 < robclark> that said, I kinda like the idea of having lists on fd.o or elsewhere, and have that be someone else's headache to admin :-P
07:08 <+keithp> robclark: easy to set up tls-smtp with auth through fd.o? Or does openshift have an smtp outbound machine?
07:08 < robclark> I think tls-smtp via some non openshift host (like fd.o) is the way..
07:08 < robclark> there are some blog post somewhere, etc, about how to set it up.. although I didn't look closely..
07:09 < robclark> but I guess since we do have fd.o that would be a good place to proxy it through (rather than a gmail acct or something)
07:09 <+keithp> seems reasonable to me
07:10 <+keithp> otherwise there's a gmail account being accessed from that machine, with a password stored in the clear...
07:10 < robclark> right
07:10 <+egbert> why can't we do email thru openshift?
07:10 < robclark> anyways.. for the members site, there was just minor change in the db.inc.php for connecting to mysql.. I guess there is something similar for wiki..  but the whole not having to manage mysql/php/etc upgrades and bug fixes, and the easy backup/restore, are really nice aspects of openshift
07:10 < whot> egbert: it comes out of EC2 and that's randomly blacklisted
07:11 <+egbert> oouch!
07:11 <+keithp> whot: that does seem compelling
07:11 < robclark> anyways, if anyone wants to kick the tires.. http://expo-robclark.rhcloud.com/login.php
07:11 < whot> fwiw, I did the restore and i think it was one command for rob to produce a tarball and two clicks + one command to restore it in my account
07:11 < robclark> and whot has another copy of it running (but I forget the url)
07:12 < whot> http://expo-whot.rhcloud.com/
07:13 < robclark> I guess probably next step is actually have a closer look at what we should do about email..
07:13 < robclark> and maybe someone else could look at moving the mailman lists over to fd.o, perhaps?  I guess/assume that could be done in advance of retiring expo?
07:13 <+egbert> so we can receive email but for sending we need to go thru some well 'trusted' provider.
07:14 < robclark> yeah
07:14 <+egbert> is that it? 
07:14 <+egbert> ok
07:14 <+keithp> ok, gabe.freedesktop.org does not have starttls on its smtp port
07:14 < whot> any volunteers to do the board email migration?
07:14 <+keithp> so, we'll need to make that work before we can have outbound mail there
07:16 <+keithp> it's either that or whitelisting expo, if it has a fixed IP address
07:17 < robclark> for php code, we have to pull IP from an env var.. not sure if that is a hint that it isn't static (or if they just wanted to avoid issues when people forgot to add .php to end of their db.inc ..
07:17 < whot> i doubt it would
07:18 < robclark> (ie. IP to connect to mysql..)
07:18 <+keithp> yeah, I sent mail to joe asking if he can push the necessary buttons; it's not hard, just fussy
07:19 < whot> so do we agree that if we can make email work, openshift is a suitable replacement for expo?
07:19 < whot> especially since we still hope to get it for free :)
07:19 <+egbert> we will have issues if the ip isn't static.
07:19 <+keithp> almost anything would be better than a machine we haven't paid for in several years?
07:19 <+egbert> at least if we want to leave it in the x.org domain.
07:19 <+keithp> good point
07:20 < robclark> I assume that should be a common issue if it wasn't static.. although tbh I didn't look at dns config yet..
07:20 <+keithp> can't we make our entry a cname?
07:21 < whot> https://help.openshift.com/hc/en-us/articles/202301854-How-can-I-set-up-my-own-domain-name-to-point-to-my-app-
07:21 <+keithp> indeed, just a cname
07:21 <+keithp> and it looks like they'll offer reverse DNS for whatever name you set
07:22 < robclark> yeah, just looking at https://developers.openshift.com/en/managing-domains-ssl.html .. if we can do cname we should be good
07:25 -!- marcoz [~oftc-webi@masquerade.micron.com] has joined #xf-bod
07:25 < whot> ok, so that leaves us with email as the last remaining todo
07:26 < whot> so again, everyone happy with openshift?
07:26 < robclark> well, that and wiki.. but wiki should be easy.. email should be the only hard part I thikn
07:26 < whot> wiki is just a phps + mysql install
07:26 <+keithp> anyone up for migrating it to something non-php based?
07:26  * danvet really not much clue about servers
07:26 < danvet> but sounds all good ;-)
07:27 < danvet> re openshift
07:27 < whot> keithp: you gonna write the code?
07:27 < marcoz> keithp: I've got some old cobol scripts I can dust off and cgi-up
07:28 <+keithp> whot: yeah, notme
07:28 < whot> exactly :)
07:28 < whot> i thought about migrating it when I looked at the code, but tbh it does the job (mostly) and chaning it for change's sake has no point
07:28 <+keithp> just the usual php security concerns
07:28 < whot> all of these are caused by the coder, not by the language
07:29 < whot> if you want to make it more maintainable, we should look at using templates first
07:29 < whot> but honestly, even if we change from one system to another it'll go from "my first php app" to "my first ruby on rails app"
07:29 < robclark> heheh
07:30 < whot> unless we manage to find an actual software package for member management
07:30 <+keithp> was thinking more along the lines of ikiwiki
07:30 <+keithp> but, that doesn't do the membership stuff at all
07:30 <+keithp> so, not interesting
07:31 < whot> a cms-like package would be more interesting
07:32 < whot> so if anyone has too much spare time, that's worth investigating :)
07:32 <+keithp> Next lifetime
07:32 < whot> anyway. openshift->email, hands up for volunteers
07:32 < whot> i.e. setting up fdo so it accepts email from openshift and hosts our board email
07:32 <+keithp> I'm asking joe rayhawk to enable TLS for SMTP on gabe
07:33 < whot> rightyo, ask him for the board list as well then please
07:33 <+keithp> once that's done, it's a 'simple' matter of creating a suitable account on gabe to authenticate to saslauthd
07:34 <+keithp> oh, move the board email list to fd.o? Or leave it on x.org and just route outbound mail through gabe?
07:35 < robclark> well, I *suppose* we could do list on openshift, given that we have to setup mail fwd'ing anyways.. but seems less effort in long run just to move board list to fd.o..
07:35 < robclark> and I'm all for less effort in long run :-P
07:35 < whot> ^^ this
07:35 < mupuf2> sorry guys, seems like every friend is buying me a shot! it is hard to follow...
07:35 <+keithp> mupuf2: it is finland
07:35 <+egbert> hrm, there is one other caveat: some stupid spam filters reject emails not delivered thru a mail server in the sender domain domain 
07:36 < mupuf2> curro and his wife are here too ;)
07:36 <+egbert> mupuf2: keep him away for piles of beer glasses!
07:38 < whot> egbert: so wait, we can't route through fdo, is that what you're saying?
07:38 < robclark> egbert, hmm..  well for what we need for expo (passwd reset emails, and I think there are some admin notif emails when new user accounts are created).. I guess that target audience that has to be able to receive the emails is relatively limited..
07:39 < robclark> although I'm not sure how I'd test much more than whether it gets through gmail's spam filters
07:39 < whot> can't we set up fdo as mx for x.org? or something like that?
07:39  * whot never had to do DNS config
07:40 <+egbert> if we route thru fd.o some spam filters may say "oh, that's not delivered from the sender domain"
07:40 <+egbert> and drop it.
07:40 <+keithp> whot: that sets the inbound mail server; do you want fdo forwarding inbound mail too?
07:41 < whot> oh, right. probably not
07:41 < mupuf2> egbert: His wife explained me your joke :D i had forgotten about this
07:42 <+egbert> mupuf2: hehe
07:43 < whot> ok, time is running out, we need to move on
07:43 < whot> mupuf2: you able to comment on the SPI review? I haven't had time to look at it yet
07:46 < whot> i guess that's a "no" :)
07:46 < danvet> must be glorious over there in helsinki
07:46 < mupuf2> whot: I sent all i have yesterday! Article 5 does not make sense when we
07:47 < mupuf2> move to SPI.
07:47 < whot> ok, so I guess homework for all is to read through that
07:47 < mupuf2> Sorry, just won another shot of salmiaki... It's horrible.
07:47 -!- variable [~meh@00018411.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:48 -!- variable [~meh@00018411.user.oftc.net] has joined #xf-bod
07:48 < mupuf2> danvet: i definitely feel more than tipsy now :D
07:48 < danvet> with salmiaki ...
07:48 < whot> alrighty. back to email then, any suggestions for actionable items?
07:49 < alanc_work> if the bylaws start making sense, then you've had too much to drink and are experiencing alcohol poisoning
07:49 -!- alanc_work is now known as alanc
07:49 < robclark> heheh
07:50 -!- mupuf2 is now known as martintetedenain
07:51 < agd5f> I gotta go and pick up my daughter.
07:52 < martintetedenain> i would like to let you know that i ate some rotten fish and my tummy hurts
07:52 < whot> agd5f: np, thanks for attending
07:53 < whot> ok, this isn't getting any more productive. so homework is read through the reviews in light of mupuf's email
07:53 <+egbert> whot: thanks! good night!
07:53 < whot> keithp: pls figure out the tls smtp and how we can route, then we can start testing
07:53 < whot> and the rest we'll figure out once we have that running I guess
07:54 < robclark> I'll read up on suggested way to deal w/ smtp on openshift, and then ping keithp once I have a slight clue what I'm talking about :-P
07:54 < whot> heh, thanks
07:55 < whot> ok, that's all for today then, thanks for attending, see you again in 2 weeks